Post by randy on Aug 22, 2022 23:42:58 GMT
I only put this in "Controversial" because I've been accused, elsewhere, of trying to teach that we can obtain our own Salvation, which is false.
If you want to get beyond the "Good" to "Salvation..."
For the record, I am neither a Pelagian nor a Semi-Pelagian. I don't think we can obtain Salvation apart from Christ, and I don't think we can even approach God apart from Christ. Please allow me to briefly explain because it is a dicey issue in light of the many disagreements surrounding the matter.
We cannot approach God unless God approaches us first. We cannot know who God is unless He reveals Himself to us. So we can exercise no virtue from God unless He first reveals it to us and enables us to do it.
Since God made Man in His image, He built us with the ability to approach Him and to do good through Him. In other words, God by nature approaches us and reveals the good to us so that we may do it.
The problem comes with the question of how Sin affects our ability to do good or to get Saved? My belief is that all men can do good, whether they get saved or not. God made men with the ability to do good, to partake of His virtues.
But this does not guarantee Salvation. God may enable all men to do good, but He does not force them to do good, nor does He force them to be saved. He has presented the Gospel of Salvation to all men, but He does not force all men to exercise it. All men can obtain from Christ the experience of Salvation, but to actually *be saved* one must embrace it--not just the *experience* of Salvation.
So all men can do good because God enables them to do it. But this does not mean all men, in doing good, are saved. Salvation comes when we embrace Christ, who is the sum total of all of God's good, minus all of the evil. In accepting him we repent of all our sins and embrace Christ as our life. This brings grace into our lives so that even though we still live in corrupt flesh we are able to receive grace for Salvation.
That means we will actually live in this new life in Christ, showing our repentance by living in the virtues of Christ. We won't do so perfectly, but in embracing Christ we show that he is our choice for all eternity. And that is enough for Salvation.
Our Sin Nature is in us, but we are not thereby forced into only sinning. Having a Sin Nature means our good nature is corrupted so that we do both good and evil. Whenever we act apart form God's word we do evil. Whenever we obey God's word in our conscience we produce good.
When Paul speaks of "living in the flesh," he is not talking about our having a Sin Nature only. Rather, he is talking about our choice to live in that Sin Nature, choosing to live autonomously and independent of God's virtues. It is an attempt to establish a claim for our own virtues, which certainly cannot reflect Divine virtue!
So when we "live in the sinful flesh," we choose to sin and cannot produce good. But if our choice is purely temporal or emotional, it is not necessarily damning. All sin can be forgiven, if it is temporary. What determines our permanent choice is when, by the Holy Spirit, one either embraces Christ or not.
But that choice is not always clear when an "emotional choice" is being made under duress or under extreme circumstances. We should always be slow to judge if we don't have a clear view on this!
To choose to do good should always be recognized, whether that choice is being made by a Christian or not. But we should also recognize that God does not recognize the choice to do good as equal to the choice for Salvation. That choice only comes by embracing Christ, who alone represents Eternal Salvation.
If you want to get beyond the "Good" to "Salvation..."
For the record, I am neither a Pelagian nor a Semi-Pelagian. I don't think we can obtain Salvation apart from Christ, and I don't think we can even approach God apart from Christ. Please allow me to briefly explain because it is a dicey issue in light of the many disagreements surrounding the matter.
We cannot approach God unless God approaches us first. We cannot know who God is unless He reveals Himself to us. So we can exercise no virtue from God unless He first reveals it to us and enables us to do it.
Since God made Man in His image, He built us with the ability to approach Him and to do good through Him. In other words, God by nature approaches us and reveals the good to us so that we may do it.
The problem comes with the question of how Sin affects our ability to do good or to get Saved? My belief is that all men can do good, whether they get saved or not. God made men with the ability to do good, to partake of His virtues.
But this does not guarantee Salvation. God may enable all men to do good, but He does not force them to do good, nor does He force them to be saved. He has presented the Gospel of Salvation to all men, but He does not force all men to exercise it. All men can obtain from Christ the experience of Salvation, but to actually *be saved* one must embrace it--not just the *experience* of Salvation.
So all men can do good because God enables them to do it. But this does not mean all men, in doing good, are saved. Salvation comes when we embrace Christ, who is the sum total of all of God's good, minus all of the evil. In accepting him we repent of all our sins and embrace Christ as our life. This brings grace into our lives so that even though we still live in corrupt flesh we are able to receive grace for Salvation.
That means we will actually live in this new life in Christ, showing our repentance by living in the virtues of Christ. We won't do so perfectly, but in embracing Christ we show that he is our choice for all eternity. And that is enough for Salvation.
Our Sin Nature is in us, but we are not thereby forced into only sinning. Having a Sin Nature means our good nature is corrupted so that we do both good and evil. Whenever we act apart form God's word we do evil. Whenever we obey God's word in our conscience we produce good.
When Paul speaks of "living in the flesh," he is not talking about our having a Sin Nature only. Rather, he is talking about our choice to live in that Sin Nature, choosing to live autonomously and independent of God's virtues. It is an attempt to establish a claim for our own virtues, which certainly cannot reflect Divine virtue!
So when we "live in the sinful flesh," we choose to sin and cannot produce good. But if our choice is purely temporal or emotional, it is not necessarily damning. All sin can be forgiven, if it is temporary. What determines our permanent choice is when, by the Holy Spirit, one either embraces Christ or not.
But that choice is not always clear when an "emotional choice" is being made under duress or under extreme circumstances. We should always be slow to judge if we don't have a clear view on this!
To choose to do good should always be recognized, whether that choice is being made by a Christian or not. But we should also recognize that God does not recognize the choice to do good as equal to the choice for Salvation. That choice only comes by embracing Christ, who alone represents Eternal Salvation.